Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

For discussion on anything retrieving related - trialing, training equipment, news, etc.

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Re: Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

Postby Kate Eltringham » Tue 11 Jun 2013 9:25 am

'morning all,

Just a few thoughts of my own as a judge.

Points have been well made by a number of contributors to this site. Many times has it been mentioned that dogs are getting out of Restricted too soon, dogs were the last ones standing so got the win etc etc.

Maybe it is time that both judges and competitors take it on board that there be a standard of competency that has to be achieved for a place to be awarded. Just because a dog finishes does it mean it HAS to be awarded a placing?

I have and will continue to say to competitors that I have a standard that as a judge I require the dogs to achieve and if that standard (number of points accrued) is not achieved 1st place will not be awarded. Before people get worked up saying dogs should be put out "if they are not working to the judges satisfaction etc" let me say I am not a mathematical genius and (other than Novice) do not add up my sheets until the completion of the trial so more often than not do not know how the points are adding up.

I have been in the position of being the only dog to finish a Restricted and was not awarded the "win". I agreed with the judge that the work my dog did was not worthy of the "win" and was happy to accept the judges decision. The reasoning was explained by the judge at presentations.

A lot of what we do is PR, a new handler to any level of competition that enters trials but is unsuccessful finishing trial after trial is going to be lost to the sport. Surely having a handler complete a trial, without achieving a placing is more beneficial than have them say “I bombed again”. How pleasing was it on the weekend to hear a number of Restricted handlers say that they had FINISHED a Restricted. They weren’t concerned about placing just that they had finished!

Certainly the proposal allowing dogs to stay in Restricted longer is relevant but more importantly keeping trialers in the sport at ANY level is paramount.

Kate Eltringham
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Location: Melbourne

Re: Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

Postby Peter Betteridge » Tue 11 Jun 2013 10:17 pm

Elio Colasimone wrote:Hi all,

It is unclear to me why RRD titled dogs could not continue in Restricted - non competitively- within guidelines... These dogs could run after the field - but would not be eligible for awards or places. This would not slow those who want to travel through more quickly. In fact some handlers slide into AA as soon as they are eligible regardless of the number of Restricted wins.

it is very clear to me Elio that handlers dont and wont run as non competing in restricted they can currently do so in NSW and they dont
people wont to compete not go to a trial and practice
the rest of your post makes al ot of sense to me Elio as does kates very insightful post
Peter Betteridge
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Location: east lindfield sydney

Re: Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

Postby John Lawton » Thu 04 Jul 2013 10:43 pm

Having been in the sport for 37 years I have seen a few changes. When I started it was win a Novice twice and you went straight into All Age, as there was no Restricted at all. Restricted was introduced back then,for this simmilar situation we have now. So what I am saying is that I must agree with Dianne's theory. Win three Restricted and gain your RRD. Allow for an additional three wins then be mandatory upgraded to AA. I have people speak to me with respect to staying in Restricted because they have to train harder to finish an AA. There are times when you will have a dominant dog continually winning and capable of running an A.A. but the handler just wants to win Restricted for the trophies.With this type of scenario you are keeping capable dogs from gaining their RRD title. If we allow this to slide too far with the current generation comming through, the wording "Retrieving Trial Competition " will become an obscene word. They will want it changed to "Retrieving Trial Participant" with no winners for the events, just a pass mark. With respect to A.A. where you are still able to compete after you have won your RTCH title. a mixture of champions and RRD Dogs that are striving to become champions. It is part of the pinnacle of our sport with winning the National as the absolute Pinnacle. This is the same in horse racing, winning the Melbourne Cup being the pinnacle of that sport. The horses must gradulate up to this level and then qualify by winning certain races before being eligible to enter the Melbourne Cup. It is starting to appear that certain competitors just want the easy road without doing the hard yards, just to put a couple of letters after their dogs name.
John Lawton
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Location: Victoria

Re: Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

Postby PennyAngel » Mon 08 Jul 2013 9:43 pm

As a very recent member of the retrieving community I have been following this thread with interest and given it much thought, after all I have only been competing for three years but I would like to still be competing in another thirty three years. I love our sport and the challenges presented to me by both my dog and myself. It is constantly evolving and having spoken to a number of handlers who have been involved for a while they agree that there have been many changes over the years. My humble opinion only concurs with most of you more experienced people. I am currently in Restricted with a dog who is my 'learning' dog. I think that is important for all of us newbies to understand. Our first dog has to be our learning dog and if we are lucky enough to get through Restricted then we are doing well! Our learning dog teaches us what is required to reach, what is to me, the ultimate - competitive in AA and able to confidently compete in State and National Titles. I am happy to see Restricted as its own stake with three wins for your title. The idea of being able to stay for another three is good - if my current dog is good enough to win three Restricted I feel I will be able to ease my way into AA with the option of running AA one day and Rest the next or vice versa. As to my learning dog...what can I say? He peaked at the end of Novice and we have a knack for hanging in there! But boy oh boy do we have fun and that is what I love about our sport.
He who has health, has hope; and he who has hope, has everything.
- Thomas Carlyle
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Location: Dungog, NSW

Re: Retrieving Trial Rule Reviews

Postby Jackie Duffy » Wed 31 Jul 2013 11:04 am

I can see no reason that Restricted dogs should not be able to compete in Restricted for as long as their owners want. My reasons for saying this are : We need to encourage people to continue to attend and compete in Retrieving trials. In Qld the average trialler is 60 years plus. The standard in All Age is very high and many people feel incapable of training their dog to that level. In general people don't want to pay entry fees and drive long distances to trials, just to make up numbers.

I have a dog that will never be a competitive All Age dog. I would still like to trial her but this is not possible under the rules at present. I have been involved in this sport for almost 30 years and am sad to see our numbers dropping off. I will continue to trial another dog in All Age.

Jackie Duffy
Jackie Duffy
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Location: Queensland


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