All Age Dogs

[Lara Sedgmen]

Prue - off the top of my head I am fairly sure that only one dog got its RTCH in NSW this year. That was Jack Lynch's RT Ch Coalsgarth Tassie Fern

Joe Laws Lindenlake Dugan also got his RTCH in April this year.

Not quite NSW, but the ACT dog Kadnook Tanks Aheap owned by the Tawtons also finished his RTCH title at the start of this year

[Jason Ferris]

Prue - off the top of my head I am fairly sure that only one dog got its RTCH in NSW this year. That was Jack Lynch's RT Ch Coalsgarth Tassie Fern

Joe Laws Lindenlake Dugan also got his RTCH in April this year.

Not quite NSW, but the ACT dog Kadnook Tanks Aheap owned by the Tawtons also finished his RTCH title at the start of this year

You are right of course Lara. Apologies Joe and Bob.

Cheers, Jason.

[Kerry Webster]

Hi there Gareth,

Obviously there is some confusion as regards to eligibility to gain this title.

I have read through both the AARD and Grand Champion criteria in the new rule book, and while the Grd Ch cannot be awarded retrospectively, a dog which gains at least 12 points on or after 1/1/2005, and that dog already has accumulated a number of points prior to that date, it is eligible to be awarded the title, as was the case I presume with those dogs which now are so titled.

On the other hand the AARD title does not give this option and has in brackets, " this rule will be effective for dogs entering trials as from 1/1/2005 and those completing qualification after that date "

From reading that, I interpreted it as meaning placings or finishes in A/A trials prior to 1.1.2005 do not count towards this title.

Maybe some RAFT committee need to clarify this for everyone. There are several dogs I know of that would qualify immediately if results from the previous year are allowed.


Kerry

[Alan Donovan]

Hi Kerry

You will notice that in Rule 107 the identical wording is used re the NRD and RRD which came in in 1988:

"...and those completing qualification after that date"

So if you had, say 2 restricted wins prior to Jan 1st, and 1 win after - your dog had obviously "completed its qualification after that date" and was eligible for the RRD.

The AARD must therefore follow the same logic - wins prior to Jan 1st this year count towards the qualification, otherwise "and those completing the qualification after this date" would have no meaning. Because "and those" means exactly that. It means in addition to dogs entering trials and achieving 10 finishes after 1/1/2005

Cheers - Alan

[Gareth Tawton]

Alan,

What do they say? Great minds think alike

Gareth

[Prue Winkfield]

Please can someon from the Victorian RAFT comment on the eligibility for AARD as I have a personal interest in this!

[Kerry Webster]

As the interpretation of this title ruling affects so many dogs, I contacted our RAFT member and queried it.

The answer I received was that my initial interpretation was correct, and that the award applies only to dogs entering and qualifying in A/A trials conducted after 1/1/2005.

Kerry

[Alan Donovan]

Hi Kerry

Did your RAFT member compare the wording of the rule concerning NRD and RRD with that applying to AARD, and explain why the interpretation of the rules should now be completely different?

Surely if a dog completed 9 All Age trials last year, and completed another one this year - it complies with the standard required for the title? It seems rather petty to withold it.

As a judge, I retain judging sheets and results for some years after the event, and would have no difficulty confirming that a dog had completed a stake that I had judged.

Cheers - Alan

[Kerry Webster]

Hi Alan,

I don't know. I asked the question and got a reply, but I can understand what you are saying, if that is how the wording for NRD and RRD qualifications was interpreted.

Not being on the retrieving scene in the year of 1988, the wording did not have an effect on me.

Regarding the AARD qualifications, I'm sure all of us would be happy to have all completed AA trials counted towards the title, as long as at least one has been in 2005. The only point I can see in not allowing this is that the wording includes " for dogs entering trials as from 1.1.2005 ".

I hope we can get official clarification on this, as I think there would be 3 or 4 dogs in W.A. eligible for the title if finishes prior to 2005 can be counted.

Kerry

[Margaret Hall]

Hi Prue,
My personal answer as a member of RAFT would be that according to the wording of the rule change as listed below

The title of All Age Retriever Dog (A.A.R.D.) may be awarded to those dogs that have completed ten (10) All Age Stakes judged by at least three different persons. Once a dog has been granted title of AARD it can only compete in All Age or Championship Stakes. (This Rule will be effective for dogs entering Trials as from 1/1/2005 and those completing qualification after that date.)

I believe that a dog can be currently competing in All Age and have some trials finshed before 1/1/2005 and have those counted as part of the AARD title. They would need to have some way of proving the trials were completed and Jack Montasell would have a record of that.
I will put it on the agenda for the next RAFT meeting so we get clarificication from all RAFT Retrieving Delegates.

I agree with Alan and Gareth on this one the way it is written allows for dogs that have already gained some points to complete the title after 1/1/2005.

PS Sorry about the delay in reply I haven't had a working computer for quite a few weeks.

Margaret Hall

[Prue Winkfield]

Thanks Margaret - that is great to get a response from our Committee.

[Margaret Hall]

For those in Victoria my information about Jack having results is incorrect, he does keep records of placings but he doesn't keep all the results. If anybody wants confirmation of their finishes in an All Age they would have to approach the judge concerned and obtain that information from them.
It is recommended that competitors obtain this information at the time of finishing the trial. I do have a draft form that was suggested for use in Victoria. Like some competitors I was suggesting a National system so all states are the same and there is no confusion.
I will bring some forms to the GSP trial in January, or I can post the form to anybody who is interested, send me an email.

Margaret Hall

[Kerry Webster]

Because of the confusion created with the wording of the AARD title rule, it is now being queried.

Apparently at the RAFT conference, members were emphatic that the award was not to be retrospective and only apply from 1.1.2005. The minutes do not reflect this however, and the wording of the rule does leave an opening for misinterpretation.

Hopefully we shall have an answer very soon, as this will affect several dogs who would have over qualified during the season of 2005, if past results can be included.

Kerry

[Leanne O'Sullivan]

Just a suggestion - would it be possible for the club holding the trial to give a certificate to any untitled dogs competing in AA who have completed the trial? I know in Victoria there are generally not that many who complete the trial, particularly untitled dogs, so it wouldn't be too much extra work for the trial committee.

I agree though that it should be a National system, whichever way we go with this. Quite a few people compete interstate and a National system would stop any confusion as to what you are supposed to do.

Leanne