Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Moderator: Peter Butterfield

Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Joe Vella » Mon 13 Oct 2014 7:31 am

Mark I think that a competitor becomes Bona Fide as soon as the club accepts the entry, listed in the catalogue and is then vetted ready to progress with the Judge's instructions.

Late entries are not accepted by clubs normally, once the catalogue has been printed and a competitor is not permitted to enter his dog/dogs on the morning of the event and rightly so.

If the dog passes vetting then I don't believe the handler has the right to take the decision to withdraw the entry.

Guys let us not misunderstand what is being pointed out here or read something in the comments other than, that If there is a problem with the interpretation of any rule then the ANKC Raft should take steps to ensure clarification.
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Amand Golle » Mon 13 Oct 2014 4:12 pm

YES, when Gareth stated that “Sadly only 7 started”, that determined the outcome according to the Current A.N.K.C Rules.
Due to insufficient COMPETING DOGS, this event should be declared, NUL AND VOID as a CHAMPIONSHIP and therefore NO CHAMPIONSHIP POINTS should be awarded.

We congratulate those who competed in this event for their great efforts with their wonderful dogs.

Kate’s initial comments were certainly relevant in this instance and we fully support this kind of thoughtful and constructive observation and we should at all times protect and enhance THE INTEGRITY of our wonderful sport.

Regards from Amand and Georgina
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Prue Winkfield » Mon 13 Oct 2014 8:42 pm

Over the years there appears to have been more posts criticising various aspects of our sport/hobby than promoting it - this conversation is a prime example. It seems that we need to be reminded that this is a purely amateur sport with amateur judges and administrators at all levels. On top of this it is supposed to be fun not emulate State or Federal politics.

If some people believe questioning any aspect of the running of our sport is warranted it should be directed to the RAFT. Certainly this should not be the Forum for people in one State to publicly criticise another either directly or indirectly. Incidentally this should also apply to personal disagreements.

We want to maintain and promote the sport to new people. The people voicing dissent (mainly All Age judges) to my mind are not doing either. New people to our sport do not need this shit and it is not surprising most appear to have little interest in joining the so called AA elite where politics seem to be the name of the game. What they might need from this Forum is information which they get and instructive help and assistance with training their dogs.

Having said this, if new people go to watch an AA Stake you will find most handlers are very welcoming and happy to impart their knowledge - myself included.
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Greg Playdon » Mon 13 Oct 2014 9:43 pm

This is a response for all triallers following previous comments posted in relation to the ACT championship

There is no doubt the Australian retrieving fraternity is in a sad state at the moment. A number of club events around the country including state championships in NSW, SA and ACT (most probably TAS as well) have less entries than previous years and could not have run events without the support of interstate competitors. The ANKC and state rules and regulations are open to interpretation in a number of areas and overzealous interpretation of these rules and regulations would likely to have led to the cancellation of numerous events. For example many club secretaries have been forced to accept late entries, incorrect entry forms and solicit entries just to get some trials “off the ground”. Thankfully common sense has prevailed and trials around the country have been able to get off the ground that may have been otherwise cancelled. This has occurred without any public outcry or inane comments.

As triallers who love the sport we can’t afford a divide our membership by becoming overzealous with personal interpretations and need to be more accepting of trialling fraternities in order for our sport to survive and hopefully flourish.

Retrieving trialling is a unique and very small minority sport under pressure to survive into future years, we as competitors, secretaries, committee members, judges, stewards etc are the incumbent caretakers, we do not own the sport but have a duty of care to look after the long term survival of the sport for future generations of people and dogs alike.

Perhaps it’s time to look at the positive not negatives and offer support where needed.

Trialling in the ACT has taken place for at least the last 40 years. It has survived both good and bad times as other states. Many of us would like all trials to continue, survive and grow into the future.

The ACT State Championship was able to go ahead with the minimum required competitors. This was very well planned trial with great consideration given to all the runs. Every avenue of both gundog and handler work was thoroughly challenged and fairly tested. There was clear guidance of what the judge required and expected, over the course of the two days a small group of people witnessed some very difficult and demanding runs which produced some outstanding dog work.

The trial was conducted with the good intention of why our sport exist in the form it does. Good dog work, trainability, team work, camaraderie and the social aspect for all those involved. When we entered the sport and this trial we did not think we would be open to the public scrutiny of individual interpretation of the ANKC rules, what we were doing was complying with our interpretation of the ANKC Rules for the good and the benefit of the sport and did so in good faith.

Thanks to the hard work of in particular the trial manager and the judge this event was not only a success but also provided our sport with some excellent public exposure. The local paper ran a full page colour spread on the front page about retrieving trials and the local ABC Country Radio attended and interviewed many of the competitors and will be airing a piece on the event this week. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-14/dog-retrieval-championships/5811222

What is the intent of this reply??

It is to reassure the trialling community that this retrieving trial was conducted with the correct intentions at all levels for the good and benefit of our sport. In our opinion the appropriate ANKC and Dogs ACT rules and regulation were adhered to.

We also hope this statement helps people to think in the future about the positives of our sport not just sit back and look for ways to be negative.

Good luck and good trialling in the future

Greg Playdon
Karl Britton
Kevin Andrews
Trevor Stow
Gareth Tawton
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Peter and Helen Eley » Tue 14 Oct 2014 12:46 pm

Could not agree more with Gregs words, we have precious sport that needs to be cared for not damaged. If there were any breached of the "Rules" then let the correct body look after them. A very brave and famous man (Douglas Bader) once said; ]"Rules are for the guidance of wise men and the obedience of fools".
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Mark Davis » Tue 14 Oct 2014 2:31 pm

Hi Pete, Douglas Bader a great man, war hero I think, lived in an era where rules went out the window. Here's a quote from a great Lady.
We learned about honesty and integrity - that the truth matters... that you don't take shortcuts or play by your own set of rules...and success doesn't count unless you earn it fair and square!
Michelle Obama.
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby John Hodson » Tue 14 Oct 2014 3:44 pm

This is our first year in the Australian retrieving circuit and as new blood we were also a competitor at the ACT championship weekend with our English Springer Spaniel.

When we arrived, we did not know anyone, but were made to feel very welcome by the Judge, organisers and all competitors.

Due to other commitments we had not been able to compete in the NSW RT Championship, so we were grateful for the opportunity to compete in the ACT Championship which, at 5.5 hours from our home in NSW, was still an acceptable distance to travel and to support.

It would have been good to see more competitors and spectators supporting the ACT championship, but although it was a relatively small field, the runs were well set up over various terrains and of course were very challenging retrieves for all dogs competing. Some of the runs were the best I have seen both here and in the UK retrieving and Field Trial circuit, and in our view, were certainly of championship standard.

The quality of the dogs and the handling was fantastic and a pleasure to watch.

In our view, the winners were all well deserved with outstanding dog work and handling.

We would like to thank the trial manager, the judge, and the other competitors who took the time and expense to travel to the trial to allow the Championship to be conducted in the ACT. The other competitors were also very forthcoming with tips and suggestions on getting the best from your dog and the sport with training methods which is vital to anyone coming in to the sport that is not that experienced and wants to compete at the top level.

We do hope that the ACT RT Championship survives this turbulent period, and we must ALL remember that it is in ALL of our best interests to support and promote the sport so that we can all continue to compete in these retrieving trials for many years to come.

Congratulations again to the winners.

John, Sirikul and ‘Milly’ Wrangham Jane Eyre
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Joe Vella » Tue 14 Oct 2014 7:17 pm

Prue,

Over the years there has been many aspects of our Gundog sports discussed and debated, at times positively and at other times not so and that is just what occurrs when people get together or an issue is presented as a topic, on a forum such as this.

I am one off who posted his two cents worth on this web site regarding this issue. I think that i am entitled to air my opinion and my dislikes. I dont believe my comments have been distastefull nor have they been offensive. My arguements in the past have at all times been with full regard of the Retrieving Game and not because it suited myself or any ability of my dogs. If anyone is not intertested in what i have to say or to read what I write then i will not be offended if he or she ignored my post.

Same as yourself I too would like to have our Gundog sport promoted and well represented. While we are on the subject of positively promoting our Gundog events I recall a National event which NSW cancelled due to the relentless pressures imposed upon it in the name of Rules and Regulations for an honest mistake it made. I won't mention who spear headed that pressure upon NSW but that's water off a duck's back and it's all forgotten now and we move on.

I was taken aback and grossly disappointed when i read your post and the language you used to express yourself. This is not you. Prue you really should consider posting an appology for it was not only distastefull but also disgusting. I would not have believed it was your post if I did not read the post myself.

Greg,

I have no doubt at all that the ACT Administration had the best intentions and that the Judge of the day had appropriately selected his test and tested the dogs as required in a Championship. The issue of dealing with lack of entries by the Aministration in my opinion was not in accordance with the ANKC Rules for the Conduct of Retrieving Trials for Gundogs. This could have happened only due to a misinterpretation of the rule. If there is an interpretation issue with any rule then the ANKC Raft should as it can do conduct an emergency meeting and discuss and debate the problem with the rule if there is one.

I don't believe we have division amongst members but we certainly have a huge difference of opinion regarding certain issues.

I have competed in many Championships over the years and i have witnessed first hand the goings on amongst competitors and alike when the Judge operates contrary to the ANKC Rules and Regulations. I ask, should this only occurr when it personally suit us or should it happen in order to maintain the Integrity of The Rules and Regulations which govern our sport of Retrieving?

I personally don't need reassurance regarding the correct intentions at all levels but unfortunately there has been an error made and this should be addressed by the powers to be.

Good onya Kate Eltringham for initializing such debate through your post regarding this issue. You have my full support and I am sure the support of others out there if you intend to make this an ANKC Agenda item.
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Re: Open thread for ACT State RT Championship 2014

Postby Peter Butterfield » Tue 14 Oct 2014 9:13 pm

Dear readers
I think it is fair to say that contributions to this thread have now drifted 'off topic', which was originally meant for the broadcast of progress reports from the ACT State Championship. I have therefore decided to draw a line and close this thread here.

All points of view, on any subject, are of course welcome on this site as long as content conforms with the terms of the site.

Should anyone wish to continue the debates above, I invite you to do so on the RA Registered Users forum or alternatively use the site messaging facilities should you wish to send personal messages.
Thank you
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